User avatar
EberWolf
Skin Diver
Posts: 41
Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2019 7:51 am
First Name: James

2 issues after travel

Thu May 26, 2022 10:16 am

I recently returned from a week in Fuvahmulah Maldives. I took my Kraken with me and came back with a couple issues.

1. Somehow the yoke nut got tightened to the point I couldn't remove the yoke to fit it into my regulator bag. for the trip back. I'm positive I didn't over torque the nut but the dive center that hosted us insisted cleaning and setting up everyone's gear. Maybe something happened during the setups?
Either way I need a better wrench to loosen the nut. What is the torque spec for that nut to properly tighten it?

2. My DSV no longer spins. How does it come apart aside from removing the screw? Does it just slide out towards the intake side? How much force should be needed to disassemble the DSV?

Jim

User avatar
2THDIVR
Master Diver
Posts: 128
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2010 4:01 pm
First Name: Scott
Location: Venice,FL

Re: 2 issues after travel

Thu May 26, 2022 7:28 pm

Sounds like a salt problem.
Bad rinse job by the Dive center.
Both probably have dried salt, in the threads of the yoke nut and in-between the inner and outer barrels of the DSV.
Dried salt in the DSV will score the surfaces if not removed.
Put a little penetrating oil on the nut, be careful not to get any on the filter side of the nozzle. Tape it.
Hope this helps.

Scott

User avatar
Herman
VDH Moderator
Posts: 1309
Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 1:45 pm
Location: Raleigh NC

Re: 2 issues after travel

Fri May 27, 2022 6:43 am

Sounds like salt water has dried in side the parts, my guess is the "helpful" dive shop didn't rinse them properly. For what it's worth, I NEVER let a dive op touch my regs regardless of their policy. This is esp true of DH regs as it's very unlikely they are familiar with them. Use the "life support" argument with them if they insist. I have had to discuss this more than once with a helpful DM, one just insisted on moving my BC position on the tank.
I am unaware of a specific spec on the yoke nut but it really just needs to be snug enough not to come loose.
My recommendation is to soak both of them in warm water for an hour or so, the reg at least with a oring sealed dust cap or better a pony bottle. The DSV should not need much force to move it.
Herman

User avatar
simonbeans
VDH Moderator
Posts: 1011
Joined: Sat Jun 25, 2005 2:00 pm
First Name: Allan
Location: Rochester NY

Re: 2 issues after travel

Fri May 27, 2022 8:08 am

I totally agree with Herman. I never "let" the dive crew set up my equipment. Most likely they have never seen a double hose in person outside of their open water class, if they even took one. Just be polite, thank them for their efforts and do it yourself. Be also careful to see how they want to route the bungie cord or whatever they use to hold your tank in place on the boat. They seem to want to just wrap it around the regulator and not the valve neck.

Maldives, 2019:
Image

Can't you just image what the guy on the right is thinking, "What the F is that thing? A rebreather?" :roll: :roll:
Check out my website: www.vintagescubastuff.com

User avatar
luis
VDH Moderator
Posts: 1693
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2005 9:28 pm
First Name: Luis
Location: Maine

Re: 2 issues after travel

Fri May 27, 2022 11:50 am

I agree with what has been said.

The yoke nut doesn't need to be tighten at all... Zero torque is OK for that nut. The alternative threaded yoke is always free to rotate, we never tighten it and it works just fine. I actually prefer it, but the new yokes are not threaded and they need the nut. Even with the nut lose, it will not move once it is on a tank.

If the regulator is not on a tank the nut is still not going to come off by itself. It required 8 complete revolutions to take off the nut. Removing the nut requires an intentional action to rotate it off. Just keep an eye that it is threaded in.


Soak the mouthpiece like Herman suggested. You may need the hose to get you some grip to rotate the inner barrel.

To remove the inner barrel you want to rotate the barrel into the closed position. Remove the screw. Rotate the inner barrel a little past the closed position and then slide it out in either direction (I always slide into the intake side).

When trying to slide it out it helps to wiggle it back a forth a little to break the static friction. That is the reason why I rotate the barrel a little past the closed position. You do not around the mouthpiece opening to be near the area of the opening in the outer barrel. That could cut the O-ring or pinch it and damage it.

Once you have it out, you want to inspect the O-rings and if they look OK, just make sure to grease them with good silicone grease. DO NOT use any of the Oxygen compatible grease or any other type grease. Only use plain good quality silicone grease (it often says food appliance compatible).
Luis

Buceador con escafandra autónoma clásica.

User avatar
EberWolf
Skin Diver
Posts: 41
Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2019 7:51 am
First Name: James

Re: 2 issues after travel

Fri May 27, 2022 12:02 pm

I soaked the DSV in warm water and rinsed it throughout the day. I got it to rotate and slide apart. Letting it dry then I'll lube the orings and put it back together.

I'll take the reg to the dive shop for access to better tools. Do you know the torque specs for the yoke nut? Is it the same 25 ftlbs as the din nut?

This fluffy tiger came in to say hi to us. I knew it was circling around but till I watched my 360 video I didn't know it was that close behind me.
IMG-20220516 WA0002.jpg
FB_IMG_1653667090951.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

User avatar
luis
VDH Moderator
Posts: 1693
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2005 9:28 pm
First Name: Luis
Location: Maine

Re: 2 issues after travel

Fri May 27, 2022 12:25 pm

You must have posted before you saw my post.

There is no need to tighten that nut. It doesn't work any better when it is tighten. Tighten the nut will just make it harder to take apart later.
Luis

Buceador con escafandra autónoma clásica.

User avatar
EberWolf
Skin Diver
Posts: 41
Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2019 7:51 am
First Name: James

Re: 2 issues after travel

Sun May 29, 2022 8:06 am

luis wrote:
Fri May 27, 2022 11:50 am
I agree with what has been said.



Once you have it out, you want to inspect the O-rings and if they look OK, just make sure to grease them with good silicone grease. DO NOT use any of the Oxygen compatible grease or any other type grease. Only use plain good quality silicone grease (it often says food appliance compatible).

Will this work for the orings?

https://www.amazon.com/Christo-Lube-5-g ... B00EQFOHL8

User avatar
luis
VDH Moderator
Posts: 1693
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2005 9:28 pm
First Name: Luis
Location: Maine

Re: 2 issues after travel

Sun May 29, 2022 10:56 am

NO, absolutely not. Please, DO NOT use oxygen compatible grease on the DSV mouthpiece.

Oxygen compatible grease will separate into a white chalky paste and oil.

Christo-Lube, Tribolube, Krytox, are all O2 compatible grease and should only be used on high pressure regulators (first stage) and valve when using high concentration O2 mixtures or pure O2. Some divers over use it in their second stages, etc. They should NOT be used with the DSV mouthpiece.

The use of O2 compatible grease in low pressure or ambient pressure seals is very counterproductive… They are not as good a lubricant and they break down, creating several problems with the white chalky paste that separates from the oil.

The O2 compatible grease breaks down and requires constant service which is not good for the mouthpiece (and many other dive gear).


Here are a few links to Silicone grease.


This is Dow Corning 111, one of the preferred silicone greases:

https://smile.amazon.com/Corning-111-Si ... 67&sr=8-16

Here is Food Grade Pure Silicone Grease, from Trident.

https://smile.amazon.com/Trident-Silico ... 67&sr=8-27


https://smile.amazon.com/Scuba-Choice-S ... 767&sr=8-8


Silicone grease is perfectly safe and acceptable, with high concentration O2 mixtures, in low pressure applications (like the second stage).
It is absolutely not an issue at ambient pressure, like the case of the DSV mouthpiece.
Luis

Buceador con escafandra autónoma clásica.

scrane
Skin Diver
Posts: 32
Joined: Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:07 am
First Name: William

Re: 2 issues after travel

Thu Jun 02, 2022 8:05 pm

I always have a problem arm wrestling the DSV when I want to change its position. The last time I took it apart I smeared a film of silicone grease on the inside of the outer housing where the square o-ring slides when rotated. I also grease the two other o-rings pretty liberally. Now the DSV rotates pretty smoothly when firm but not Herculean twist is applied. I dive in a sand free environment. Is there anything wrong with this approach?

User avatar
luis
VDH Moderator
Posts: 1693
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2005 9:28 pm
First Name: Luis
Location: Maine

Re: 2 issues after travel

Fri Jun 03, 2022 9:45 am

scrane wrote:
Thu Jun 02, 2022 8:05 pm
I always have a problem arm wrestling the DSV when I want to change its position. The last time I took it apart I smeared a film of silicone grease on the inside of the outer housing where the square o-ring slides when rotated. I also grease the two other o-rings pretty liberally. Now the DSV rotates pretty smoothly when firm but not Herculean twist is applied. I dive in a sand free environment. Is there anything wrong with this approach?
I don't see a problem with that.

The key is good lubrication of the O-rings.

The primary purpose for the two circumferential O-rings is as a bearing to keep the inner cylinder and the outer cylinder from rubbing on each other. They are also intended to seal sand and other dust from getting between the two cylinders. They are not sealing air since the chamber between the cylinders is intended to be wet.

The only O-ring that seals the breathing air passage is the O-ring around the mouthpiece.

All three O-rings need to be well lubricated with good silicone grease.


When entering or exiting through a sandy beach surf, it is always best to keep the mouthpiece in your mouth. It will help you breath and will keep the sand out of the mouthpiece.

I also recommend installing the hoses tight against the outer big cylinder. Push the hose tight against the mouthpiece and the tighten the hose clamp. That will tend to create a seal to keep sand out of the gap between the inner and outer cylinder.

YMMV
Luis

Buceador con escafandra autónoma clásica.

scrane
Skin Diver
Posts: 32
Joined: Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:07 am
First Name: William

Re: 2 issues after travel

Fri Jun 03, 2022 3:12 pm

Thanks, Luis.

User avatar
EberWolf
Skin Diver
Posts: 41
Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2019 7:51 am
First Name: James

Re: 2 issues after travel

Wed Jun 22, 2022 4:23 am

Thanks for the help Luis.
I got the yoke nut loosened and put it back hand tight. I also ordered and received the silicone grease. Got the DSV O-rings lubed up and put back together. All is good.

Have a dive/bath planned at a local wreck (AL Boom) on Friday. Ocean temps are in the 90's here.

Thanks again.

Jim

User avatar
SurfLung
Master Diver
Posts: 1703
Joined: Sat Jan 01, 2011 2:03 pm
First Name: Eben
Location: Alexandria, MN
Contact: Website

Re: 2 issues after travel

Mon Jun 27, 2022 11:33 am

luis wrote:
Sun May 29, 2022 10:56 am

Here are a few links to Silicone grease.


This is Dow Corning 111, one of the preferred silicone greases:

https://smile.amazon.com/Corning-111-Si ... 67&sr=8-16

Here is Food Grade Pure Silicone Grease, from Trident.

https://smile.amazon.com/Trident-Silico ... 67&sr=8-27


https://smile.amazon.com/Scuba-Choice-S ... 767&sr=8-8


Silicone grease is perfectly safe and acceptable, with high concentration O2 mixtures, in low pressure applications (like the second stage).
It is absolutely not an issue at ambient pressure, like the case of the DSV mouthpiece.
Thanks Luis,
- My DSV worked fine until I gave it away to a friend and bought a new one. I re-lubed the new one with SuperLube Silicone grease. And it has never worked the same as the original... Always sticky, even right after I greased it. I'm now betting it's because I'm using the wrong grease?

Also, No Offense but... I refuse to order from Amazon if it can be avoided... Here are a selection of Silicone greases sold by LeisurePro/Scuba...

https://www.scuba.com/l/?searchinfo=sil ... _New-Items

I'd appreciate if you'd recommend a few of these. - Thanks, Eben :)
SurfLung
The Freedom and Simplicity of Vintage Equipment and
Vintage Diving Technique are Why I Got Back Into Diving.

Return to “Phoenix and Argonaut Specialty Area”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 11 guests