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Bryan
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Pro Diver...Piston or Diaphragm?

Sat Aug 05, 2017 3:14 pm

member regulatorbj sent me this photo of a Pro Diver 1st stage.....Looks like a piston regulator.....The ones I have worked on were diaphragm like a Conshelf....Anyone have more info on this ?
PRO DIVER. INTERNAL 1987-91SJPG.JPG
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Doing it right should include some common sense, not just blindly following specs and instructions. .Gary D, AWAP on SB

lexvil
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Re: Pro Diver...Piston or Diaphragm?

Sat Aug 05, 2017 4:50 pm

Looks a lot like an Aquarius internally in a UFO body.

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couv
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Re: Pro Diver...Piston or Diaphragm?

Sat Aug 05, 2017 5:34 pm

Agree-looks like an Aquarius.

Lex, I've sent you a PM.
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luis
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Re: Pro Diver...Piston or Diaphragm?

Sat Aug 05, 2017 6:55 pm

I see a couple of major differences from an Aquarius.

The air passage to the back of the piston is not through the piston. You can see an air passage from the LP port.

Also the HP seat seems to be an independent floating secondary piston. It looks like there is possibly a balancing chamber just below the HP seat carrier. Is this supposed to be a balanced piston regulator?

Is there a part break down?
Luis

Buceador con escafandra autónoma clásica.

lexvil
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Re: Pro Diver...Piston or Diaphragm?

Sat Aug 05, 2017 7:17 pm

luis wrote:I see a couple of major differences from an Aquarius.

The air passage to the back of the piston is not through the piston. You can see an air passage from the LP port.

Also the HP seat seems to be an independent floating secondary piston. It looks like there is possibly a balancing chamber just below the HP seat carrier. Is this supposed to be a balanced piston regulator?

Is there a part break down?
Missed the line running back.
Interesting, I'm not regulator expert by any means, it does look like an internally equalized steam regulator with that small line running Back to the piston. I would assume it is sealed and works to maintain set pressure regardless of external pressure??

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couv
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Re: Pro Diver...Piston or Diaphragm?

Sat Aug 05, 2017 7:48 pm

Sharp eye Luis. I missed the channel running to the piston head. I saw the hole in the (balance chamber?) and thought it was a flow-by unbalanced piston.
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Bryan
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Re: Pro Diver...Piston or Diaphragm?

Sat Aug 05, 2017 7:53 pm

Was busy when I posted it but now that I look at it closely I see what you are talking about. I've never seen a parts breakdown for the regulator in the picture.
Doing it right should include some common sense, not just blindly following specs and instructions. .Gary D, AWAP on SB

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luis
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Re: Pro Diver...Piston or Diaphragm?

Sat Aug 05, 2017 9:29 pm

lexvil wrote:
luis wrote:I see a couple of major differences from an Aquarius.

The air passage to the back of the piston is not through the piston. You can see an air passage from the LP port.

Also the HP seat seems to be an independent floating secondary piston. It looks like there is possibly a balancing chamber just below the HP seat carrier. Is this supposed to be a balanced piston regulator?

Is there a part break down?
Missed the line running back.
Interesting, I'm not regulator expert by any means, it does look like an internally equalized steam regulator with that small line running Back to the piston. I would assume it is sealed and works to maintain set pressure regardless of external pressure??
The IP has to track the ambient/ external pressure in order for any second stage to work properly. We are not seeing the ambient pressure holes, but I am sure they are there, somewhere on the circumference around the large spring (the wet chamber).


The regulator does seem to be a balanced flow by piston. Balanced meaning that the pneumatic forces are balanced and are not affected by tank pressure. The IP would not change with tank pressure, bu it will still track and follow the ambient pressure.

The IP channel connected to the LP port and feeding the head of the piston implies that the piston does not have an air passage down the center (like most other pistons).

Then that little hole next to the HP seat implies that IP air is fed to a balancing chamber at the small tip of the piston. It does look like a compound piston with two moving parts.

There are probably two O-rings that we cannot see. One O-ring is hidden by the big spring and the other one inside the HP seat holder.

At first I though that in principle it might used a similar balancing approach as a Sherwood, but I am not seeing it that way. I have to think about it some more. I wish there was more information about it.

Thanks
Luis

Buceador con escafandra autónoma clásica.

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couv
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Re: Pro Diver...Piston or Diaphragm?

Sat Aug 05, 2017 10:13 pm

Is it possible that the hole we see is just for a roll pin that holds a seat carrier onto a solid piston stem? That would make this an unbalanced flow by piston-just not the type we are used to seeing. I suppose the increased size of the seat might have some positive effect.

I do see an o-ring on the piston head, and my un-sharp eyes think they see another o-ring just above the seat carrier/balance chamber.

On the other hand, if that is a hole then yes, there should be at least one o-ring in the balance chamber which would make it work similar to a pneumatically balanced poppet second stage.
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luis
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Re: Pro Diver...Piston or Diaphragm?

Sat Aug 05, 2017 10:32 pm

The outside shape of this regulator looks somewhat different to the Pro Diver shape. It has two different angles of taper which is different to the Pro Divers.

I actually think that I have seen this regulator, but I can't place it.


Couv,
That doesn't look like a roll -pin hole to me. I still think that the piston has two semi-independent moving sections.
Luis

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couv
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Re: Pro Diver...Piston or Diaphragm?

Sat Aug 05, 2017 10:41 pm

Just under the filter is a (spacer) seal-then what? I cannot make it out.

BTW who makes Pro Diver? Is that the brand or is that a model name? How old would this reg be?
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Herman
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Re: Pro Diver...Piston or Diaphragm?

Sun Aug 06, 2017 8:11 am

I know I do this at my own peril but I disagree with Luis. :shock:
I think it’s an unbalanced flowby piston. I don’t see any place for the balancing forces to be applied. It does seem to be missing an ambient vent hole but that may have been removed during the cutaway. The small hole in the piston is likely just the common bleed to the piston head and the passage from the LP port is an enhancement to it for better responsiveness of the IP….possibly the “Pro” in Pro-diver. If you look just above the main spring, there is a space just inside the main body; I am thinking there should be a sealing oring there. It appears to me that rather than the piston sliding through an oring in the body, the oring is captured in a groove in the piston stem and slides inside the body.
I would love to get my hands on one to figure it out.

Looking at it closer....I think I do see an oring in the area above the main spring.
Herman

vintagefrank
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Re: Pro Diver...Piston or Diaphragm?

Sun Aug 06, 2017 5:43 pm

Hi Bryan,

that´s not a Pro Diver first stage but a La Spirotechnique Club first stage as can be seen in their 1989 catalog page 8. This first stage was a piston operated first stage.

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Bryan
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Re: Pro Diver...Piston or Diaphragm?

Sun Aug 06, 2017 5:52 pm

vintagefrank wrote:Hi Bryan,

that´s not a Pro Diver first stage but a La Spirotechnique Club first stage as can be seen in their 1989 catalog page 8. This first stage was a piston operated first stage.
Thanks for the information! Any chance you can send me a PDF of that catalog? Actually I'd appreciate any catalogs you could share.
Doing it right should include some common sense, not just blindly following specs and instructions. .Gary D, AWAP on SB

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luis
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Re: Pro Diver...Piston or Diaphragm?

Sun Aug 06, 2017 6:20 pm

Hi Frank,
Thanks for the information. I have been looking at all the Pro Diver and other US Divers/ Aqua Lung regulators and I could not find it.

BTW, I don’t think it is a Club, I think it is an La Spirotechnique Explorer.

I was looking at this web site.
https://www.spiro-vintage.com/reg-anglais



And here is the description of the explorer. It has a "compensating" inner piston according to the diagram. That is why it has that separate air passage.
The EXPLORER regulator came out in 1983 in two versions with a second metallic stage. The standard version and the R version which always means a second stage with a sensitivity device. The first stage is a balanced piston mechanism with one output HP and 3 outputs MP.

Image


Here is the diagram for the Explorer

Image

Image

Image


Here is the description of the club. The Club is described as a non-balanced first stage.
The SPIRO CLUB was released in May 1980 to replace the series 20. Robust and reliable, built as a "tank", the SPIROTECHIQUE launches it on the market to compete directly the MK2 R190 SCUBAPRO. A very good regulator piston mechanism but which will not happen to dethrone his rival.

Here is the club

Image

Here is the diagram for the Club

Image



Image


Image
Luis

Buceador con escafandra autónoma clásica.

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